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View Full Version : Minor Grade 3 - Prolotherapy or Second opinion?



mezimeen
16-03-2007, 04:56 AM
Hello everyone. Its been 5 weeks now into my shoulder separation. Did it playing hockey. Anyway, I'm 27 and my doctor at first thought it was a grade 2. I had a lot of muscle and perhaps a high pain threshold that hid the severity of it. As the weeks have gone I've had PT 3 times a week, getting ultrasound and scar tissue broken up - not to mention lots of tape to keep the clavical in a better spot. Recently I saw my doc again for a 4 week check up and he said surgary wasn't an option, but admits the 'step off' is a bit big, and that maybe with an increased strengthening regiment it will get better. he is also considering prolotherepy if it does not improve in 2 more weeks. Here's my problem: I play hockey at a pretty high level all year round, and my main goal is to get strength and stability back. The step-off does not make me visually hurt, but it does not feel normal at all. Will time make it better? WIll i get used to it? Has anyone had prolotherepy done? What i know is that it's an irratent injected into the ligament to call on the anti-bodies and blood to help in the healing process. Great....but will it work? I'm thinking of getting a second opinion because of the lack of precision.

Cheers to all who have the shoulder bump. and thanks for any help in the future!

kjwilkin
16-03-2007, 10:24 AM
Hello everyone. Its been 5 weeks now into my shoulder separation. Did it playing hockey. Anyway, I'm 27 and my doctor at first thought it was a grade 2. I had a lot of muscle and perhaps a high pain threshold that hid the severity of it. As the weeks have gone I've had PT 3 times a week, getting ultrasound and scar tissue broken up - not to mention lots of tape to keep the clavical in a better spot. Recently I saw my doc again for a 4 week check up and he said surgary wasn't an option, but admits the 'step off' is a bit big, and that maybe with an increased strengthening regiment it will get better. he is also considering prolotherepy if it does not improve in 2 more weeks. Here's my problem: I play hockey at a pretty high level all year round, and my main goal is to get strength and stability back. The step-off does not make me visually hurt, but it does not feel normal at all. Will time make it better? WIll i get used to it? Has anyone had prolotherepy done? What i know is that it's an irratent injected into the ligament to call on the anti-bodies and blood to help in the healing process. Great....but will it work? I'm thinking of getting a second opinion because of the lack of precision.

Cheers to all who have the shoulder bump. and thanks for any help in the future!

Hi there,

If I was you I'd definitely get another opinion. A good first point of call is to see a good sports physician. Whereabouts are you based ? If you can go to a sports physician that is linked to an elite sports team they are likely to have contacts with some of the best physios and orthopaedic surgeons. Both my sports physicians work with 2 of Melbourne's AFL football clubs. They often deal with shoulder injuries so have a good understanding of my problem.

I currently have shoulder instability and am seeing Greg Hoy, a specialist shoulder surgeon in Melbourne. He's meant to be one of the best in the business. There are even some athletes that come to see him from overseas. It's really important that you go to an orthopaedic surgeon that specialises in shoulder problems.

Is the physio you are seeing a shoulder specialist ? It's really important that the physio you are seeing specialises in shoulders. That way you have the best change of a good recovery regardless of whether you have conservative or surgical treatment.

Good luck and let us know how you're progressing.

angieliu
16-03-2007, 11:42 AM
I agree with KJ I think that it is worthwhile getting a second opinion and to ensure that your sports doctor and physio specialises in shoulders. I first started seeing a physio who treated more generalised injuries and ended up makig my shoulder weaker than it initially was. I'm now seeing a great physio who specialises in shoulders. It makes a huge difference.

hopeful
16-03-2007, 04:07 PM
will time make it better? yes - give it about 4 months and u will see an improvement

will i get used to it? yes, and you also dont have a choice

it will never be the same as before, but it will be enough for you to function in your daily life whether you do sport or not. you just need to adapt.

hope that helps

mezimeen
23-03-2007, 07:12 AM
I'm back. Had a second opinion and had the same result. However i was told it was probably a severe grade 2. Either way my concern is still getting full strength and stability back. The fact that the bump can look small depending on my shoulder position and angle tells me that its not compleatly healed to its capability, or atleast i hope it can heal further...I'm supposed to get back into hockey in 6 more weeks (if anyone is wondering I live in Toronto, Canada - insert joke if you like) and my Docs think I'll be ok as long as I progress at the same pace I am right now. I just have to continue strengthening.
In 2 weeks I'm going back, only to perhaps try Prolotherapy. My Doc said the window of natural healing is 8-10 weeks so if by 8 weeks he's not entirely happy we're gonna inject some gunk into a couple of ligaments. oh the joy! Otherwise, it's looking a 'bit' better, feels a 'bit' better, and although it feels like someone has there thumb jambed in my shoulder all the time I'm feeling a 'bit' better over all.

I'll be back in a week...I've started girl push-ups, 10lb arm lateral/straight raises and basically beefed up the regiment. Lets see what happens.

So...anyone ever tried Prolotherepy?

angieliu
23-03-2007, 07:56 AM
Hi there,

When I saw the specialist I was told that if you have an unstable shoulder that you would be up for at least 12 months of rehab to strengthen the shoulder. I would wait for the 8 weeks for your shoulder to heal and then start considering rehab for it.

When I started shoulder rehab I could barely put any weight on my right shoulder and now 6-8 weeks I've seen quite a bit of improvement. It might also be worth going to see a sports physio to try to get some more exercises to stengthen your shoulders.

By the way what is prolotherapy?

mezimeen
04-04-2007, 05:06 AM
hey guys,
So its been 7.5 weeks now and I just had my first shot of Prolotherapy. I did some reasearch and basically it can't make it any worse. It's an irratent (glucose) and something else, that's injected into a ligament or tendon which then inflames the area and promotes healing directly in and around any area that has limited blood supply (such as a ligaments). Felt like a needle going in, except for the movement to dispurse the solution around the ligament. That felt a bit weird. Anyway, it feels better and in 2 weeks I'll have another injection (5 total). The shoulder has been getting better but this should make the ligament stronger and more stable which is what I want the most because I'd like to play hockey at the level i was at before.
So all in all, it was interesting and I'm hopeful. I'll keep posting as good (or bad) news arrises.

I have one question though, what is your shoulder like for anyone who has had a minor grade 3, or major grade 2 separation WITHOUT surgary? Thanks!

cheers.

vinben
16-11-2008, 01:15 AM
Hi
I have a grade 3 shoulder separation and it has been about 4 weeks and just heard about prolotherapy. I live in Hamilton ontario and was wondering if there was any place near me that i can contact. I'll go as far as Toronto or a bit further.

thank you

ac joint doh!
25-03-2009, 09:05 PM
hi i also had a grade 3 seperation and also had an operation to put it back where it should be, there seems to be a huge differencein opinion from us doctors, there also seems to be a lot of people with huge problems because they did not have surgery. I can't comment too much at the moment because i inly did mine 3 weeks ago and still have very restricted movement. i think i made the right choice to have surgery, definatly get a second opinion! ideally from an othapedic surgen who knows sholders. The docs opinion was if your young and active you need surgery if your old and dont get out much dont so what does that tell you!!

Duffman
08-04-2009, 10:57 PM
I suffered a grade 3 seperation (later suspected to be a grade 5) at the beginning of September 08. The recommended treatement was the conservative form of basically putting my arm in a sling for 4-6 weeks and hoping it gets better. At the end of this period there was still a lot of instability and discomfort so the doctors decided to leave it another 4 weeks hoping it would get back to normal function. Throughout this period I was seeing a physio who gave me various exercises. Although the pain decreased it never went away.
After going back again to see the consultant they finally decided I needed a modified weaver dunn which I had at the end of January 09. Now I'm almost at the end of my recovery period of no resistance and looking forward to starting training again. I only wish the operation had been done at the time as I will have lost 6 months to this.
I understand that surgery should be avoided if at all possible, but it was clear that conservative treatment would not give me the same use of my shoulder I had before the injury. If you look into the treatment of the injury you will see that opinions vary widely
My advice would be to get a second opinion but don't focus on having surgery, if you can avoid it then great, make sure you do your physio and don't push it too far!! But to be fair I think it comes down to the individual and how your body heals itself.
Good luck with everything, and remember you're not alone!