Should Gehrig have surgery?

[Danny]

Looks like the Saints are leaning towards a Surgical option straight away. What do you think though? Can the saints afford to play without him for the 4-6 weeks? An interesting decision to be made.

Gehrig blow as Saints' toll mounts
By Mark Stevens
July 5, 2005

ST KILDA has suffered another savage blow, with full-forward Fraser Gehrig in danger of missing four to six weeks with a serious thumb injury.

It is believed the Coleman Medal favourite suffered a ruptured ligament late in Sunday's courageous victory against the Western Bulldogs.

Although Gehrig emerged from scans yesterday saying he was "as sweet as a bun", it is understood the real story is far more sour.

Gehrig requires surgery ? it is just a matter of when.

The Saints were last night grappling with a delicate decision of whether to put Gehrig under the knife now or after the season.

It is understood the Saints are warming to the long-term advantage of immediate surgery and a recovery period of 4-6 weeks.

If Gehrig plays on, the injury would need to be heavily strapped and could hinder his performance.

Gehrig would also risk more significant damage, making off-season surgery more complicated. The worst-case scenario would be a complete reconstruction of the joint.

The latest cruel development on the injury front at Moorabbin potentially leaves the club without its three key forwards: Gehrig, Nick Riewoldt and Aaron Hamill.

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Riewoldt has dodged surgery, but will miss up to eight weeks with a cracked right collarbone.

Hamill, missing for two months, is at least another fortnight away from resuming after a calf problem.

Robert Harvey will also miss at least four weeks with the third recurrence of a right hamstring injury.

Gehrig has a ruptured ulna ligament, commonly known as "skier's thumb". The joint was hyper-extended in the dying minutes of Sunday's match.

If the Saints go down the surgery track, he may be able to return in four weeks with the help of a guard.

The advantage of the relatively simple immediate repair work is the "G-Train" would be back to full fitness a fortnight before the finals.

The Saints will then be hopeful he can still play a key role in September.

Although the Saints are still in touch in ninth place with a 7-7 record, they will be desperately undermanned for the bulk of the rest of the home-and-away season.

The club started the season as premiership favourite and last night was on the fourth line of betting at $8.

But with Gehrig's news, the odds on the desperately unlucky Saints delivering in September are likely to blow out further.

Gehrig, who last night escaped a charge for slapping Bulldog Brian Harris, kicked four goals on Sunday.

The 29-year-old, who kicked 103 goals last year, was yesterday rated a $1.70 chance to win the Coleman Medal despite trailing Hawthorn's Mark Williams.

Gehrig has kicked 48 goals this year, five behind Williams.

The Saints will almost certainly turn to Barry Brooks this week to fill a forward role.

St Kilda's key talls have been cut down all season.

Justin Koschitzke missed six matches after injuring a hamstring against Geelong in Round 7 and then suffering a quadricep strain.

Luke Penny has been hampered by knee problems all season. He again looked to be struggling with knee soreness at the weekend

Herald Sun

[injuryupdate]

If he can still play, then of course he should delay the surgery. If he can't take a mark then he should get it done.

[bonnie]

If he can still play, then of course he should delay the surgery. If he can't take a mark then he should get it done.


If he were to have the surgery it is likely that he has played his last game of footy.
Thus why he will give it every chance as is.

[Chook Raffle]

If he were to have the surgery it is likely that he has played his last game of footy.
Thus why he will give it every chance as is.

Are you suggesting he will retire at the end of the year?
Despite what the club says they can not do without Gehrig, Hamill and Riewoldt at this stage of the season. I doubt he will go the surgery route. With all due respect Gehrig missing a thumb is more useful in the forward line than Barry Brooks.

[bonnie]

Are you suggesting he will retire at the end of the year?
Despite what the club says they can not do without Gehrig, Hamill and Riewoldt at this stage of the season. I doubt he will go the surgery route. With all due respect Gehrig missing a thumb is more useful in the forward line than Barry Brooks.

Very unlikely to play past this year. Pretty much a given that he wont.
Why?
Injuries and no money in the salary cap.

[Danny]

Looks like he's going to be given the chance to play this weekend. Surgery takes the back seat at this stage.

[Chook Raffle]

Looks like he's going to be given the chance to play this weekend. Surgery takes the back seat at this stage.

Interesting article by David Schwarze in the Age about the long term ramifications of delaying surgery for this type of injury. I saw Gehrig training on Fox footyand he was handpassing and punching with his gloved hand but that could have been for the cameras. If Reiwoldt and Hamill were available, he would not be playing.

I think he will play on next year too (I hope).

[injuryupdate]

The Schwarz article is below, but he is talking about a different injury (ruptured 4th finger flexor tendon). Most guys don't end up as bad as Schwarz describes, and those who do get surgery often need to miss 10-12 weeks. Difficult decision in these cases - often you need to look at the ladder, if you are playing for Carlton you get the surgery, if you are playing for a team in the mid sections of the 8 you delay it.


Gehrig ignores thumbs down
By Lyall Johnson
July 8, 2005

Fraser Gehrig risks losing almost total movement in his thumb by not having it operated on immediately, according to former Melbourne star David Schwarz, who received a similar injury in 2000.

Schwarz ruptured the tendon on the ring finger of his left hand in round 15 that year and now has virtually no movement in the finger.

"If I was him, I'd get it fixed in a heart beat, but back then the last thing I wanted to do was miss six weeks. He should definitely get (the operation) done now because long-term it's not worth it," Schwarz said yesterday.

Now a broadcaster for radio station SEN, Schwarz said he had decided not to have the tendon repaired because he was in the twilight of his career and feared not being able to break back into the Melbourne side as it headed to the finals. "I was 27 or 28 and I'd been battling, so I wasn't sure if I was going to get back in. But if I was at the start of my career, I would have got it done (straight away)," he said.

"Once the ligament goes, there's nothing. If I pick up a can of Coke, it just sticks straight out . . . I'm no good picking up things and swinging the golf club; I can't grip things properly."

A sports doctor, who asked not to be named, said the injury would slightly restrict Gehrig's ability to mark the ball at the weekend, partly because of the brace he will wear. And being left-footed, it would also restrict his ability to drop the ball straight on his boot.

He said reconstructive surgery weeks after the injury was more problematic and less successful than surgery to repair the tendon immediately because over time, the tendon shrinks and cannot be rejoined. Gehrig injured the tendon in his thumb in the Saints' win over the Western Bulldogs last Sunday.

It is believed St Kilda sought the advice of one of Australia's leading surgeons, who strongly advised Gehrig to have immediate surgery, but Gehrig decided to play anyway.

Wearing a protective brace and glove over his hand, Gehrig trained yesterday without any noticeable problem but was not greatly tested.

"He's been around long enough and knows his body better than anyone else, so we'll just go with what he thinks and he hasn't had any concerns about playing or not so he's always been very strong in that resolve," St Kilda coach Grant Thomas said.

"(We just need) to protect him and to protect what we need each week . . . we just have to be very stringent with it. It's not painful because there is nothing attached. It's just functionality. The operation needs to be done, it's just a matter of when."

Thomas said it was up to medical staff to assess whether Gehrig was risking long-term problems by not having an operation immediately. "We've got absolute faith in them to do that so he won't be compromised," Thomas said.

He said the club had considered whether Gehrig decided to play because of injuries to other key forwards Nick Riewoldt and Aaron Hamill but was satisfied his choice had nothing to do with them

[injuryupdate]

Played pretty well today - so far justifying the decision to keep going.

[bonnie]

Played pretty well today - so far justifying the decision to keep going.

But can he play well enough to justify more money for a contract next year. Or has the money already been spent on keeping the kids & Hamill?

[Chook Raffle]

But can he play well enough to justify more money for a contract next year. Or has the money already been spent on keeping the kids & Hamill?

Following is an article from the Saints website (extract from Sportal). I am not sure of the exact rules or ages, but he must surely almost be ready for the veterans list in which case I think only half his salary is counted towards the cap (whether they can afford him in a financial sense is another matter). In terms of can he play well enough, I think so.

Talks with Gehrig to start soon
11:32:08 AM Sun 29 May, 2005
Paul Gough
Sportal for afl.com.au
St Kilda is set to start talks with reigning Coleman Medalist Fraser Gehrig over a new contract with coach Grant Thomas revealing the move following Gehrig's match-winning performance in his 200th AFL game on Saturday night.

The "G-Train" kicked seven goals as the Saints lifted themselves back into the top eight with a 43-point win over Sydney and ominously Gehrig has suddenly moved into third place on the goalkicking tally with 32 goals for the season.


And this is despite an injury-interrupted pre-season and a recent one-match suspension with Gehrig telling afl.com.au after the win over the Swans that he feels he is only just starting to regain full fitness in what shapes as an ominous warning to rival clubs in the second half of the season.

"I thought I was starting to go okay but the suspension (suffered against Collingwood in round six) set me back a bit," Gehrig said.

"It was only a week but it affected me and I am still not completely happy with my fitness.

"But the extra work I did at training this week helped me and I haven't been able to do that for a long time so hopefully in the next few weeks I will continue to be able to do that."

There had been speculation during the week that the 29-year-old former Eagle might be in his last season given he is out of contract at the end of the year but Thomas dismissed such talk as 'absolute rot' following the win over Sydney.

"He (Gehrig) basically indicated that St Kilda hadn't started talking to him about his contract and then he said a throw away line that maybe (as a result) he would be finished at the end of the year," Thomas said.

"A mountain was made out of a molehill and we will be talking to Fraser's management (about a new contract) in the next few weeks.

"It was always the plan to do it mid year and he is a vital player for us.

"And if he has got the desire to continue at this level and his competitiveness is still there he could play for a few more years yet and we expect him to."

As for Gehrig he is just focused on ensuring St Kilda again plays finals and said the team still has a lot of work to do to get back on track despite the win over the Swans.

"Everyone was under pressure when we were four (wins) and five (losses) and we had lost a couple of winnable games but we are still under pressure now at 5-5," he said.

"We are still not on our mettle yet but we are not far off the pace."

"We have got a few big games in front of us and the next one is against Port (who ended the Saints' premiership chances last year with that memorable preliminary final win in Adelaide) and hopefully that will be a season-defining game for us."

[Chook Raffle]

But can he play well enough to justify more money for a contract next year. Or has the money already been spent on keeping the kids & Hamill?
I saw Gehrig hurt his thumb in a marking contest in the game last night...he is playing the team game well, proving his worth, but he dropped quite a few marks.

[Dunlop65]

Following is an article from the Saints website (extract from Sportal). I am not sure of the exact rules or ages, but he must surely almost be ready for the veterans list in which case I think only half his salary is counted towards the cap (whether they can afford him in a financial sense is another matter). In terms of can he play well enough, I think so.

You have to be 30 which Gehrig will be, but as I understand it you have to be a 10 year servant of the club which Gehrig isn't so all his salary would still count towards the cap.